The Sex Reimagined Podcast

Briana Bass: Men Vs Women | The #1 Reason Couples Fight About Sex (And How To Fix It) | #162

• Leah Piper and Dr. Willow Brown • Season 3 • Episode 162

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Does this sound familiar? You used to tear each other's clothes off. Now you're scheduling sex like dentist appointments—and still canceling. You're wondering: Is this just what happens in long-term relationships? Is the spark gone forever? What if the problem isn't your attraction, your partner, or even your sex life—but a fundamental misunderstanding of how intimacy actually works?

In this episode of Sex Reimagined, we sit down with Briana Bass, a board-certified sexologist and therapist who helps high-functioning couples transform their intimacy. After climbing the corporate ladder to senior vice president, Briana made a radical career change to help people solve the very problems she witnessed in boardrooms: emotional disconnection, burnout, and the slow erosion of desire in long-term relationships.

EMOTIONALLY FOCUSED THERAPY FOR HIGH ACHIEVERS

  • Why Type A personalities struggle with emotional intimacy
  • The powerful questioning technique that breaks through intellectual walls
  • How to help partners who say "I don't feel anything" access their emotions

RECOVERING FROM INFIDELITY

  • How to hold space for both the betrayed and the betrayer
  • Boundary-setting conversations that rebuild trust
  • Understanding the "origin story" behind cheating

LINKS & RESOURCES MENTIONED IN THE EPISODE CAN BE FOUND ON THE WEBSITE


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Willow:

What happens when a former corporate exec turns her no BS lens towards sex, love, and relationships? Brianna Bass is a therapist and board certified sexologist who helps high functioning people cut through patterns, heal their intimacy, and transform their lives, their lives. In this conversation, We're diving into the raw truth about modern dating, burnout, and the messy, beautiful intersection of ambition and desire. I'm Dr. Willow Brown here with Leah Piper. We are your co-host for the Sex Reimagine podcast. We are so grateful for all your wonderful likes, shares, and subscribes. Keep them coming, and we cannot wait to dive into today's conversation.

Leah:

That is right. And so my friends, if you've been with us for a while, you know what to do. And if you're new to the show, then this is your chance to tune in, oh baby, turn on, and fall in love with Brianna.

Announcer:

Welcome to the Sex Reimagined Podcast, where sex is shame-free and pleasure forward. Let's get into the show.

Willow:

So excited to have you.

Leah:

welcome to the show.

Briana:

Yeah, I love our group here.

Willow:

Mm-hmm.

Leah:

So I'm really curious, you started off as an executive and then you found yourself in the world of therapy helping couples and individuals. So tell us a little bit about what caused you to pivot into a different industry professionally.

Briana:

Yeah, you know, corporate America is, it's tough. You gotta behave in a way that you might not feel like is ideal or aligns with your values and and whatnot. And so all of that, uh, environment, just, I eventually, you know, kind of had enough and I returned to my roots. So I really didn't reinvent myself. I returned to what I think my sort of more organic, authentic state was. And I had my bachelor's of science and psychology and had been studying human behavior for a while. So for those reasons it felt actually like, okay, I'm going back to what I feel at home in and. Ultimately in corporate it was the, the most masterful education and why people do what they do. You are in this like ecosystem of people fighting for survival, trying to make decisions, balancing life and their families and all these things. So you are quite literally in a bubble of this, this great experiment on, ooh, what will people do? What choices will they make? What should I do to strategically change my circumstance here? So it all played into each other really, really nicely. Um, but yeah, ultimately I made the, the big shift because I wasn't happy in corporate America and I felt like there was more to life and I wasn't happy with the one life that I had been given and how I was living it.

Willow:

Hmm. What? What, at what point did you make this shift? Like how far into the corporate America? I've never played in that world. I can only imagine like how sort of like soul sucking it might feel because you have to put on like different masks and different facades in order to kind of survive in it. It seems like.

Briana:

You're completely right. You do have to put in different mass, different facades. You do have to survive in that way. You know, we call that the technical term is cognitive dissonance, where, you know, yeah. That's the technical term for that. We see it in relationships a lot and, and things like that. But, uh, I talk, I talk about that a lot with people. But, um, yeah, I was pretty far in, so I was senior vice president, I believe it was in my last role. So I climbed that corporate ladder. I had put in a lot of work to get there, and then I get to some of those top rungs and jump ship, uh, which felt really ridiculous. Right? Talk about sunk costs. You're going, oh my goodness, I've invested all of this. Am I really gonna hit this eject button now? And I sure did. I've never regret it. Not for one moment.

Willow:

good. So how long ago was that?

Briana:

Oh, maybe five years ago, something like that.

Leah:

Mm-hmm.

Willow:

so right before the pandemic kind of,

Briana:

Yes, yes, yes. Yeah. Those

Willow:

that, was that a tricky time then?'cause you, you worked, worked, worked, got to the top, then jumped ship, and then fucking COVID hit.

Briana:

Yes, exactly. Um, COVID for me though, I used, uh, unintentionally, but in hindsight as this catalyst to put these pieces in line, just like we heard of other people that were like, actually, I'm gonna go back to doing pottery, or I'm gonna

Leah:

Right. I'm gonna go back to school.

Briana:

Yeah, So many people, or they were like, I'm getting divorced, I'm sick of this. I'm out. Like, we so many divorces happen. There you go. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Me, me too, me too. Um, I've been, I've been doing that also, so it's like, which, you know, I think that that was a, a, a, a spawn of it. So yeah, COVID for me, um, you know, re-shifted focus like so many of us. So same thing where we thought, wait a minute. When I really look at, if my loved ones were taken away, if I was taken away, if I, you know, really made you think about this one chance and how delicate life was and how this thing was such a threat to our everyday existence. And it was like, oh my God. And so everybody's priorities just got this incredible amount of attention. Yeah. And we had, we were like, okay, let's make some different decisions.

Leah:

So what do you think? You know, uh, I know that you work with a lot of couples, probably couples that have been in relationship for a long time. And as we know, a lot of sex gets a little routine, can start to get a little boring, becomes a little sexless, the longer people are together. Um, and then you have people who are just longing for the beloved longing for the one, and feeling like they're failing at dating. What do you think? I think especially for couples, what do you think couples are getting wrong when it comes to sex?

Briana:

Yeah. To, to your point right about understanding. First off, I would say you need to understand biology. You need to understand neuroscience. And that's kinda my focus and like why we do what we do so that you can delineate between, there's an issue in this relationship, or I am facing, um, I'm quote, broken like many women and men come and say versus, Hey, my body's doing this thing that's actually rather predictable. And it's just a part of, of, of how we operate. So for example, right in the beginning when we're having sex in a relationship is new, sex feels more effortless because of novelty. That newness is so intoxicating and your brain does this phenomenal job of flooding you with

Leah:

best cocktail.

Briana:

Mm-hmm. Dopamine, norepinephrine, oxytocin, all these things are happening. You have a lot of vasopressin too because you know you're trying to impress each other and you know all, all these things and you're waiting on their texts and it feels so exciting and fun. So what people don't realize is all that extra periphery and all that extra stuff and all those neurotransmitters and all these mechanisms firing are absolutely contributing to your sex life being awesome. And when that novelty, that newness, that initial period is removed, then those things that I just talked about really, really, really taper down. So therefore you would probably have less sex, maybe less exciting, or all sorts of things, less frequency, you know, whatever. So that's exhibit A. I think couples really need to understand that so they don't misinterpret, um, the house being on fire or they're being some incredible issue when it is kind of normal, typical.

Leah:

Yeah. I call it the ooh la la phase. When you've got that cocktail that is just so easy to access when you're dating somebody new and it all those ooh la la's come on, and then I think the love gets established. You start to find security as you start to define the relationship and what you mean to each other. And then that brain chemistry is much harder to access, but the love is deep. So then you lean into the love and you're not necessarily leaning so much into the sexual aeros of it all. But then usually someone starts to complain like, what's wrong? Because we're not horny like we used to be, or you are not horny like you used to be. Sometimes we're blaming one person for the lack of desire. Has that been the case for you? That you've got one partner going, I want more sex, and the other partner feeling like pressure and obligation and like, they just don't feel connected to it in the same way.

Briana:

Absolutely, and there are some gender, uh, gender sort of influences on that? You know, I, I'd have to say of course, that for the most part it's the men saying, you know, not always, of course not, but, but generally speaking, the men are, you know, maybe desiring it more. And the females not so much. And, you know, the, I I've had people bring in their wives and say, can you fix her?

Leah:

Oh, totally. I

Briana:

I, I uhhuh a hundred, a hundred percent. And so as far as what I teach my men, and, and I know everyone's heard this, but I don't care because it seems to not be all that sticky, is that, you know, men have sex to feel connected and women have sex when they feel connected. So we can all see the issue there. That's an issue. We're going like totally different directions. So men will tie sex directly to, um, their identity, love, validation, all sorts of things like that. Versus women often tie sex to different criteria. Um, and so there's a lot of differences I see between, you know, the men and women coming in and, and, and, and how they operate in the space of sex. But definitely the most dominant one is that. I, her and I just had a fight or we're in a rough spot, so let me go ahead and reach for her, which is beautiful, right? That's his, his attempt to say, let me make this feel better. Let us get connected. Let us have sex or, or even a makeout or hookup in some kind way.

Leah:

Mm-hmm.

Briana:

And this is when she's the most repulsed. And she's like, no, we just had a fight. Or things are in a lull right now, or We've been having resentment lately or conflict, or, I tried to come to you about this problem I was having at work and it turned into X, Y, Z. And so no, this is when I want to reject you the most. So I, for them to identify that that pattern is happening, one breads weakness into the male side where he is like, okay, it isn't about my masculinity, my validation, my identity. This is coming from her end and she's feeling a certain kind of way. And for those reasons, her intimacy, her arousal isn't like firing on all cylinders. And for the female, she's seeing it as kind of. A dick move. Like, what? Why are you using me like an object or chasing me like a piece of meat or leaning into this thing that feels very intimate for me when we're not in this great place? And so for her kind of learning, that's actually his attempt at connecting with you, reaching for you, wanting to improve the circumstances. I think that understanding, that helps a lot.

Willow:

Yeah, that is super useful for all couples who are dealing with that, which is many, many, many couples. Now, let's say you've got a couple you're working with who they, they, may understand it, but they're still kind of stuck in the, you know, well, fuck you. Don't get close to me. I am in a mood, I am in a state, and he's just like, well, I don't know what else to do. Like, that's the only thing he can think of. Like, then what, where do you guide them from there?

Briana:

Uh, the first thing I would talk to them about is probably the eight forms of intimacy. So outside of, you know, sex, what other things are we doing as far as intimacy? Intimacy is concerned? So the seven other ways, right? So how are we connecting there? Because that's gonna be the case, that sex takes a dip, or we feel stuck. Or where do I go from here? That eight forms of emotional intimacy and looking at those, especially for men, right? Very literal, very tangible. You can truly

Willow:

great. Give me a checklist. Yeah,

Briana:

Yeah, And that's one that's like an easy win where I'm like, okay, this sort of feels like a checklist. And, and they get, it's like very under easy to understand and to grasp and hopefully, but very likely by investing in those other seven forms of intimacy, the non-sex ones, it should bleed over and improve that eight one, and especially again on the female side per our conversation a moment ago. That as he makes her feel more safe, you know, maybe they take a walk together, they go see a show together, or they have some intellectual conversation. He listens to her about her day, they cook a meal together. I don't know, whatever these things are could be spiritual. There's, there's, it's, it spans a quite diverse range, so there's kind of something for everyone and you can sprinkle it across the all, right? Um, and some of them are, are naturally happening in your day to day, but as we go on and we get in our routines and we orbit around each other, you know, we just, we just lose some of it. It, it is natural. It happens. So I would talk with them about where are we at with these seven other forms, and you know what, maybe let's just even put the sex things on ice and just focus on these seven other things and then we will, we'll circle back to that.

Willow:

Mm-hmm. So you have to tell our listeners what the seven other forms of intimacy are.

Leah:

Give us some examples. I think I heard you say like a spiritual connection, like if they have a shared sort of faith that they can bond over, like cooking together, having experiences. Um, but yeah. Could you give us a few more examples?

Briana:

Yeah, I wanna, I feel like I have them memorized so there's emotional, which is gonna be, um, you know, I, I. I felt today at work, like an Im an imposter. I, I I, I was in this meeting and, and I just, it felt like I, I didn't know what to say even though I'd studied it. And for your partner to just receive that vulnerability from you and that emotional moment and say, you know, oh, that sounds awful. I've experienced that feeling too, and it's the worst. Right? And for my men, you know, we're not gonna try to solve it or, or tell her that she should study more or you.

Leah:

This is what you should have said,

Briana:

Yeah. Yeah. Or like, yeah, you, you shouldn't feel that way. Um, you know, because you are great. I see the beauty in all of that. But, you know, reminder not to solve and you can get to that. Right. But when someone kind of throws you that ball, I talk about throwing the ball a lot. When she throws you that ball, just receive it and hold it. Observe the ball and talk about the ball itself if you feel stuck. So if I've got a male and she, and, and she's come to me and said this thing, and I'm like, I don't know what to say back. I dunno what to say back. Everywhere a step is a, is a bomb and a, and a, and a landmine. You know? Well talk about the ball then. Talk about the ball. Oh, so you,

Willow:

I like that analogy. That's a good one.

Briana:

you were in that meeting and Oh, that, okay. You know, the, the ball, the meeting, the, the imposter syndrome, you know, that kind of thing, right? It's like a little, another like layup. Um, the other forms are, I wish I had these written down right now. Intellectual. So intellectual. Yeah. That's you all connecting on something intellectual, right? So now we're

Leah:

a book you just read or a podcast episode you just heard.

Briana:

Absolutely. Or your personal maybe thought or take on something that sort of has like an intellectual spin to it. Um, that all counts. Um, another thing is goal planning. So we're talking about next year we wanna go to Europe, you know, what would we need to save a month? What would we need to do to reach this common shared interest. Interests is common shared goal. So any kind of financial planning, we want kid to go to this college. Yeah. Oh, that's a beautiful way to say it. Yeah. that's a beautiful way to say it. They should replace that with dreaming together, but yeah. Um, the other ways are experiential, so that's going and golfing together while she sits in the cart or Yeah. Taking an art class together. So neither one of you are good and have any idea what you're doing and you're just like, stick figuring it and like being like, you know, those, those kinds of things. So

Leah:

my husband and I just did that.

Briana:

Oh, you did?

Leah:

I dragged him to, I love to dot paint. I mean, this is like an old one.

Willow:

You took Matt to dot painting.

Leah:

I did.

Willow:

What did. he do?

Leah:

em.

Willow:

Did He like it? Did he like it?

Leah:

God bless him. Um, yeah, I mean, he doesn't need to go to another one, but like he came, yeah. But he came and he, he would probably go again if I asked him.

Willow:

Yeah. Okay, so

Briana:

right though that like you guys weren't even, you know, graded it or he, it's not even his thing necessarily. Right. Maybe it's more swayed towards you and then the next time, like you can go do something that he, you're like, okay, I'll go see that Marvel

Leah:

Like I'll go to the gym with them. Right. I

Willow:

it, and it could be maybe something that like neither one of you're very good at. Let's go learn how to do tango together or something, you

Leah:

yeah. Let's go take a pickleball class or,

Willow:

Or even just going to the beach. Let's go to the beach together and

Leah:

Yeah. I always drag him to like cooking classes when we travel. I mean, he rarely cooks at home, but still it's like, yeah, you, you have those shared experiences together and sometimes you do something that may not be as interesting to you, but you do it because it's something that they are excited about.

Briana:

Absolutely. So, and you know, think of how you would internalize that, right? Even further, it's so layered. It would be so much even further than this experiential thing that you're sharing. You'd be like, wow, they're willing to show up for me and do this, that, you know, they don't really get a lot out of it, and I know that this isn't their thing, and so they're just showing up for me in this way to make me feel seen and, and nurtured and cared for and important.

Leah:

Yeah. And to spend time with me. Yeah. Like it makes you feel like you matter, you know? Like, I mean, look at the smile on my face. Like just remembering the fact that he painted a butterfly and he painted a lady bug and he made a little jar, and the shit he's never gonna use, we'll probably throw them away. But regardless, like,

Willow:

The experience. Experiential.

Leah:

Like, it just makes me love him so much that he makes that effort, you

Willow:

He is gonna get good sex later.

Leah:

Oh my God. Like I call'em boner points

Willow:

Yeah. Bone

Leah:

really are doing something great. I'm like, oh my god, 10 boner points for you. And he's like, when do I get to cash in these boner points? I'm like, he's got a million by now. We've been married for 10 years. I'm like, dude, anytime. That's what boner points are for.

Briana:

Exactly my point though. You felt arousal, you feel like some sort of openness and safety and like, Right, these boner points, it's, yeah,

Willow:

You're in, you're in.

Briana:

translating directly into willingness and interest in sex.

Leah:

Yeah, and there's a cherishing, like I feel really cherished by him that he makes that effort and it makes me wanna cherish him. Like it's, it's a loop, right? We're, we're creating new circuits when we put effort into our partnership.

Briana:

Yeah, absolutely. Um.

Willow:

two more to go. You're doing good, girl. What are the last

Briana:

Um, okay. Spiritual is a, is another one. I'm glad you're counting.'cause I am not. So, yes. Spiritual. Okay. Spiritual, right. We're connecting on, on spiritual. I need to figure out like better definitions of these things. Or just self-explanatory. So you could be, yeah, you could be, yeah, you could talk about like existential stuff. Like why are we all here and what do we think? Or you share, you know, if you're not necessarily religious and maybe you're not participating in some sort of sect, like going to church or something, you do something else that makes you feel connected. So maybe it's a walk, but in particular, you know, you all believe in nature and us, you know, whatever it is that's kind of your thing, but it has some sort of spiritual nature to it. That's a completely different category.

Willow:

Yeah. Love it. Okay. There's one more to go. So we've got emotional, sexual, intellectual dreaming together. We're renaming that one from goal

Briana:

Okay. Which is financial. Yeah.

Willow:

Okay. Experiential and spiritual

Briana:

Um, did we say sexual?

Willow:

Do I I list, I listed it. Creative is the last one.

Briana:

Creative. Yeah. Creative is the last one. Um, and that's you guys doing something together that has creativity and it doesn't have to be even with your hands, although that's

Willow:

in the garden

Briana:

Yeah, yeah.

Leah:

together.

Briana:

Project in the house. It could be even more simple than that.'cause I really want people to take away that these things can be, you can come across them in, in already existing moments throughout your day.

Willow:

can be very nuanced. Yeah.

Briana:

Yeah.

Willow:

Like even breathing together could be spiritual And creative.

Leah:

Yeah.

Briana:

Yep. Yep. You're exactly right. Yeah. Yeah.

Willow:

all start to kind of

Leah:

right, like creating plans for the weekend or creating, deciding what you're gonna do for the birthday party for, you know, kid number two or, um, cooking together or having a garage sale together. Something, you know, that takes effort that you both contribute. You know, maybe you're redecorating the bedroom

Briana:

A big one that I talk

Leah:

though I wouldn't trust my husband to redecorate the bedroom.

Briana:

maybe

Leah:

I'm like, I'll help you redecorate your man cave.

Briana:

You.

Leah:

Exactly.

Briana:

just there for emotional support. Yeah. Um, another one I talk about that's very accessible, and again, like very literal, is watching, um, TV together, which we're all doing that, right? But if you choose not to just sit shoulder to shoulder and just like in silence, watch, but instead, like think of like watching Real Housewives or some trashy reality tv. You guys are both like, I mean, you, you've seen a couple watch 90 Day fiance together or something. They're both going, what an idiot. Can you believe they just did that? Or the female saying, well, she did it because of whatever. And maybe he's saying, yeah, but she, and you know, you kind of banter and back and forth about what you're watching. That definitely counts. That's a big one that like, people are like, oh, okay, I can do that one. I can do that one.

Leah:

yeah, yeah. Watching a

Willow:

funny that

Leah:

like together.

Willow:

one would bug me.'cause I don't like anyone to talk when I'm watching a show.

Leah:

really? I think like sometimes we got into love on the spectrum and it was just

Willow:

oh that was the sweetest.

Leah:

like this. We both just felt like so opened and just it reminded us of like the importance of things. We had good conversations as a result of watching something really sweet together. Um, I remember we also watched, uh, blue Eye Samurai, which had some really great naughty cartoon scenes, and it was like we got to talk about, wow, look at that. You know, there was this house of pleasure and you have like these threesomes happening. And anyways, we had fun conversations over just a sex in a cartoon. Who would've thought. So if anyone hasn't seen Blue-Eyed Samurai, Netflix, highly recommend.

Willow:

Okay, good to know. All right, so now the woman has, he is like gone to these seven other things. They're now more intimately connected, so now she's more open to sexuality. Right. So then how does he then get his need filled of through sexuality, feeling more connected for himself?

Briana:

Well, one, I would say the frequency, the quality, things like that should typically be improved from the investment across the seven. So not only are we back to like having sex, let's say, but ideally it would be of, of, of higher quality. Um, and to be really crystal clear about that, that doesn't necessarily mean, you know, performative or a better show or more porn like. Um, so another piece to kind of answer that about the guy getting his needs met and feeling like, you know, this is all going well, or, or, or the sex life. This, this eighth level of intimacy, intimacy is also getting some traction. It would be, you know, being incredibly curious in the bedroom, trying not to be so mission oriented, meaning like straight to orgasm or that being like the goal. That's the goal. That's the goal. Um, I need to get her there, I need to get her there and or on his end. Right. Um, same thing,'cause both partners can feel that pressure and feel a little bit of stress. And as soon as we have pressure in the bedroom or stress about anything, whether it be getting to a goal or a fight, you recently had absolutely anything. Even work, it zaps intimacy. It is such a killer, especially for women. We get to fight or flight really easy in sex and anytime we're in fight or flight, we just intimacy it just falls out

Leah:

Yeah, and climax is really hard to reach during those moments of stress. Or if we're in our head and we're thinking about the list and we're thinking about,

Willow:

thinking that we need to get to the orgasm in order to make him feel like he is

Briana:

a hundred percent.

Willow:

virtuoso,

Leah:

Yeah. Right, right.

Briana:

Yeah, you're exactly right. Yeah. There's a pressure that a lot of women face from thinking, I've got to get there, because if I don't, he's gonna ask me or maybe feel a certain way, which is really beautiful, right? He's concerned, he's like, oh gosh, I wasn't good. Or, you know, whatever. I see the beauty in it, but it can be a killer, right? Because she's going, oh no, versus just enjoying the interaction despite of reaching that or not.

Leah:

Okay, so it sounds like we have to build trust and we use these different types of intimacy to build more trust so that we, because I think for a lot of women, they need to feel safe in or in order to open up sexually. And it's one of the reasons why when there's a fight or a rupture, that trust and safety also feels like it's been ruptured. And it's why we can't just land and open our body and say, okay, take me now for a lot of women, not everyone, um. So I can see how the intimacy kind of rebuilds some of that safety and that trust between within our connection. But what about novelty? Because I think what's happening with a lot of women is they don't, they're not in the mood because frankly they're not having the sex that they want. And they don't really know what, how to say the type of sex that they want. But I think novelty is a part of the answer to that. It's wanting to kind of be ravished and be taken and not have to manage one more thing in their world that she's in charge of, you know? So there's a decision fatigue sometimes I think swamps a woman's ability to sustain arousal. What do you have to say about how to give her the sex that she wants. It's not just about fucking and checking it off the list. Okay, we've had sex, we're a success. It's how do we have good sex?

Briana:

Yeah, the, the thing with the whole talking to go, to go to that point first. So they did a study recently, um, I'd cited if I could, I don't know everyone Google it, but, um, essentially they looked at a, a significant, a substantial amount of, of couples from all backgrounds and, and age ranges, and those that were having good sex versus those that didn't feel that they were, and tried to find like, what is a common denominator here? And the common denominator, shockingly, was not toys in the bedroom or the novelty. It was the ability to talk openly and very comfortably about the topic of sex. That's what it was that they found was the biggest common denominator. And I have found that in my practice, that if I have a couple or one partner and we talk about sex, I will eventually and very intentionally ask them about, you know, some of the conversations. And sure enough, just about every time they're very clunky or it feels taboo, it feels very uncomfortable, they sort of, you know, squirm or, you know, something like that, right? So there's this, uh, there's this incredible connection between the ability to communicate very openly about your bedroom life with your partner that yields good results. Also in the bedroom, they kind of just tie into one another. So, uh, you know, what did you ask me?

Leah:

So, no, you're answering the

Willow:

Yeah, you're doing great.

Leah:

it's really about having the type of sex that you want. Some, I,

Briana:

Oh yeah, you gotta talk

Leah:

know, yeah. It's like I, I would want more sex if I was having, if you could gimme the sex that I want.

Willow:

this good, the

Leah:

A lot of times they don't even know what the sex is that they want. They just know they don't want what they're getting. And so I think a lot of people stay stuck and I don't like what I'm getting, but what's really unhelpful is they don't say what it is that they want that could be different. Um, or we get so defensive in the conversation that we don't know to have the, how to have this conversation well. Where like, I think the word you used earlier was curious. Can we be so curious about our partner

Briana:

Yeah.

Leah:

know what they think and what they feel and what opens them and what closes them and you know, what they think about. I mean, what I've come to see in my own life and also working with students is even if we're talking about fantasies, like it doesn't mean that because I have this fantasy, I need you to play out the fantasy with me. It's the closeness that happens when you know this part of me that I have this little kinky, you know, corner I go to that turns me on and I got, and I trust you so much that I'm sharing this part of myself with you and no, I don't wanna play it out. There's a lot of shit we desire that we don't actually wanna experience. It's more a delight in our mind than it is something we would delight it in person. That's kind of what I'm imagining when I hear you say that.

Briana:

You're exactly right. And that's an, that's an example of, of, of exactly what I'm trying to talk about, which is that. It's not even necessarily that the goal or objective in talking about it, was to go act on something. Although it can be. Just the, just the connection from the verbal communication, the showing yourself, the unzipping yourself. There's so much vulnerability in it. Talking about sex, talking about the bedroom absolutely will improve and translate into feeling more present in the bedroom. It also kills insecurity sometimes, right? So,

Leah:

Ah, yeah,

Briana:

yeah, anytime we can name a problem, everyone knows that, right? Like admitting a problem, you know, really, really, you know, makes it shrink. So

Leah:

the charge comes off of it a bit.

Briana:

Yeah, it does. Right? So, you know, when we can discuss something openly and, and in a really safe way. And safe meaning like, is this person gonna judge me? Are they gonna snarl? Am I, are they gonna weaponize this against me? They're gonna throw it in my face when we argue it's gonna be used against me, or are they gonna receive the ball that I'm throwing and it's gonna go okay. So if we can kind of get to that space with talking, it really will be a testament to overall the investment you're making in this partnership and how connected you all you all are. So you've got a couple that the sex isn't happening, you know, we're, we're doing the eight forms of intimacy. I think that's certainly step one or like a really top couple. Um, the other piece with that would be, instead of us feeling like we have this mountain to climb, where we're gonna go, they're gonna go have this like porn star. Uh, the toys and back to the novelty thing sex. What if we just mastered discussing it? Just talking about it? That feels far more achievable and sometimes less scary. It depends, but sometimes less scary. So we could just start with having really beautiful conversations about how a partner feels or things. And you can even go so back to that, where it's like the least close to actually sex. And talk about like what you saw your parents do, your relationship with sex as you were growing up. What happened if a scene came on the tv? Did someone be like, you know, gross or, I don't know why they include this, or they turned it off, or, you know, were, how, what was the birds and and bees talk like from your parents. Those are kind of like funny

Willow:

Those are really

Briana:

conversations. Yeah.

Willow:

Yeah. those are really good like actual questions and cues and, and things for people to talk about.'cause gosh, as you're, as you're sitting here talking about, you know, have more open conversations about sexuality, I'm like, I am so far down the other side of the spectrum where I talk about sex all day long with every single person that I meet. So, like, uh, I can't, it's hard for

Leah:

you are like, you wanna talk anal?

Willow:

yeah, I'm like, it's hard for me. I have to like curb my conversation with people. I have to dial it down. So it's hard for me to even relate that

Leah:

So are you a,

Willow:

talking about it. So I'm really appreciative of these specific questions, like a good starting point for a couple. You know, like, what, what's, I mean, I often will ask people, what's your relationship to your sexuality? And that even can be sometimes a little bit too much of a daunting question. Like, I don't know, you know, they don't have an answer for it.

Briana:

It can feel really broad to receive what's your relationship like with sex, unless you've got like a little bit more of a senior client that's kinda like a therapy veteran. And yeah, I think a great way to walk that back and make it more bite-sized to kinda like get them there is the whole

Willow:

Yeah.

Briana:

birds and bees talk. What'd you see on the tv? Uh, what did mom and dad say? Did you ever walk in on them? Did you see one

Willow:

Was there, was there an MTV video that really turned you on? You know which one

Briana:

Oh yeah.

Willow:

guys was, um, white wedding.

Leah:

Oh really? I like November rain

Willow:

Oh, that one was hot too.

Briana:

that is a great question.

Willow:

That's a good one for you all out there.

Leah:

But, I like that, like who taught you about sex and what did the church have to say about sex? What did your parents, were your parents virginal or you know, were, did they overexpose you to sex? I mean, there's all these things that happen that do inform our condition to response

Willow:

and also.

Leah:

you understand your partner and their reactions A ton. If you can get underneath. Like what that was like as in their formative years because it's there.

Willow:

I think too, like what, what was your first sexual experience like Did you, like, did you enjoy it? You know?'cause I feel like for a lot of women, they just kind of go through it and do it and fumble and da da and guys are like trying, they're like, yeah, I enjoyed it, but I just still was just making it up as I went along and didn't really know. And so even just for yourself to speak that out loud with a partner, like what, identifying, what was that first, first couple of sexual experiences like for you? I remember kissing a boy in the closet with like skates digging into my back, my girlfriend's roller skates. And we were in the closet, we were like 16 years old and

Leah:

Yeah. The things you end. Yeah.

Willow:

was like so uncomfortable because I had fucking roller skates in my back. You know, the kissing wasn't good. It was 16-year-old, didn't know what we were doing, but

Leah:

Yeah. I'm

Briana:

I love that question.

Leah:

um, now do you, do your clients come to you with things like they're getting over, uh, cheating, infidelity, trauma, or. You know, they did share something really vulnerable. Maybe it's a kink that they have, you know, maybe it was something, and the other partner's just judging them and shaming them. Like how could, how could that ever turn you on? And they're totally stuck because one person's in disgust and the other person's like, crushed. You just yucked My yum. And how do we get through that?

Briana:

Yeah, I, I don't so much have partners that shared, you know, a kink or something like that, and their, and the receptivity just, just wasn't there. The reason, well, okay. The reason why I think I don't see that very much is I think that the clients coming to me wouldn't even be in a position on their own where they'd be sharing that kink to even be, and have the

Leah:

haven't even,

Briana:

the client or the, the partner reject them or make them experience shame.

Willow:

Mm.

Briana:

So I think my clients are being, um, you know, very, um, discerning and incredibly buttoned up and maybe not entirely forthcoming. So that's probably why I wouldn't see that. So, not that the kinks don't exist and aren't there, it's that they would sort of be fighting against the typical therapy client if they are anywhere in a position to sort of share this, this thing about them. Um, my clients typically know that maybe would not land well and would anticipate shame and judgment from their partner and then avoid it entirely.

Leah:

What about infidelity?

Briana:

Infidelity. Absolutely. I see people that are recovering from infidelity or are trying to repair after such a big rupture and it can be quite painful. And I have all the empathy for that and, and it's certainly understandable and, and you've got these, you know, really hard thing with that is holding space for both partners experience with this because you feel like you wanna just emphasize the quote victim, right? The the person that was cheated on. But we have to. Also for things to really work, focus on the cheater in that they got there. Perhaps for some reason, I'm not making excuses for them, that's different. But a lot of times when we choose to cheat, there was some sort of journey. There was some origin story to that villain, right? Hey, I, I felt like a, a loser in my house. I felt insecure. I, I, I felt like my masculinity was being questioned or I didn't feel desired as a woman. And there was this guy and he made me feel, seen and special and heard. And so when we do therapy, we have to talk about all of that too, because it's incredibly valuable. But that's difficult, right? Because it does feel like I'm making excuses for the partner, or they're getting to sort of tell their justifications. And it's not about that. It's, it's simply if we really wanna understand each other and, and rebuild from this incident, then we will have to look at kind of all these contributing factors. And then as far as sort of enacting things. That would improve the circumstance. It's um, one, walking through the noise, right? Talking in a controlled setting about the, the, the pain that this caused the partner. And then again, listening in a non-judgmental way about how the partner got there to the other partner, got there to begin with. And going to those basics with the intimacy again, you know, maybe sex is not gonna be on the table for a while, it just feels too unsafe. So we're gonna build safety in some of those other categories to kind of get back there. And then another thing about, um, recovering from infidelity is that we do wanna have quite, uh, like, um, boundary setting conversations. Like what do you guys want this to look like moving forward? You know, from, are we sharing each other's phone passwords? Are we tracking locations? What does that look like for you? Are you wanting check-ins now when they leave, you know, what is it that you're asking for? What are your asks to help you sort of get through some of this, this hump?

Leah:

Right. Yeah. I imagine that could be a place where people get really stuck. It's like, um, sometimes there can be the asks are because of, so, because the trust has been so shattered, the asks might feel like really invasive or controlling. And do you. You know how much, right do you have to go, no, I'm actually not. Okay. I'm not willing to do that. Can we find a workaround? Uh, that must, I bet people get stalled right there.

Briana:

They absolutely do. And you're, you're right. And that's couple by couple. It's, it's not for me to say, someone's going, Hey, this is, I'm, this is where I'm at right now. I need your phone password, I want your location shared. I want check-ins. Okay. Alright. They can ask for it. And so let's have a conversation about that. And if the other partner's going, absolutely not. That feels, um, you know, that just feels maniacal and I, and I, and I'm not comfortable with that. I'm not gonna do that. Okay. And now at least we're in this controlled setting where the other partner can say, I'm internalizing that then as you still don't love me, you don't care enough about the pain that I'm in to do those things, to jump through these hoops, and then we can talk about that. So no matter what great productive, valuable conversation points, that, Yeah, that's a part of the infidelity um, sort of treatment is figuring out what does this need to look like? What's realistic? What are the partners ask, you know, what are your boundaries? Is there a before and is there kind of an after this incident and you know how we're gonna behave differently?

Willow:

Uh, what, what's a typical sort of journey like that a couple will go through in when they're working with you? I mean, do they kind of come in and just start with, with, uh, with no sort of like a three month container or, you know, or do you sort of hold them in, you know, sections of, of containment, sort of as, as they're going through their evolution together?

Leah:

Um, what are you asking? Like how, what's the length of time?

Willow:

Yeah, just like, is it kind of open-ended? Like sometimes you step into therapy and it's like, oh, I'm just gonna go to therapy once a week for the rest of my life. And other times there's more like a, you know, this is a three month journey and then we'll reassess.

Leah:

Yeah. Have you noticed like, um, a pattern of time that someone really needs to have some stick-to-itness? Because I could see how people, you know, they start the process, it gets hard, and then they just give

Willow:

Yeah. You

Leah:

I imagine having, like, you need to commit to this because there's gonna be moments where you're gonna wanna quit and there needs to be some accountability for you sticking with it. I don't know how, how does that work?

Briana:

Yeah, you're right in that, you know, it's gotta have some longevity to it for us to really move this needle. This isn't like a, when you feel like it or on occasion thing, right? So I hope that somebody is committed to coming in at a cadence that makes sense for growth. So weekly, every other week, something like that. But if somebody drops off, you know, I really don't do anything about that. I mean, I, you know, I might shoot someone a text and say, just checking in with you, but that's the limit. I, you know, everyone takes their own approach. My personal approach is, um, you use your free will. If you, you know, don't feel comfortable continuing to invest in this, I'm not going to pursue or chase you. Um, I have a very, like, we're all adults here, kind of thing with it. But as far as sort of getting ahead. Of it. I will discuss with people what this path ahead may look like, and I will talk with them about, it may get worse before it gets better. I'll also talk with people about emotional hangovers and that you're coming in here, we're not talking about what's going great. We're typically only talking about like bad stuff. So if you're coming in and just offloading, Hey, I'm, I'm feeling this way, I'm, I'm feeling insecure, I've lost myself, I'm, I'm lonely. Um, this is what I'm facing in my relationship. You're maybe not gonna be walking out, you know, frolicking through daisies. You, you might have a little bit of a. A dark cloud over you for a couple of days. So I get ahead of some stuff to kind of dispel it. And again, like the theme of today when you talk about it, it really sort of pops this big, big heavy bubble. And so we'll talk about that. I'll talk about a, an an appropriate cadence that I recommend weekly, biweekly. And I will also talk about, you know, if you are in a relationship as couples, uh, therapy, something that, that you are interested in. Um, and we will cross that bridge when, when someone gets there.'cause often, more often than not, I'm even surprised by it, individuals will come in with the intention of couples coming, but they'll go by themselves first to feel things out. You know, perhaps, especially if they feel like the other party is a little bit more resistant, they're gonna wanna try to curb risk. Maybe they're thinking, this is, I know I'm only gonna drag them in here one time, so I gotta make sure, you know, this goes okay. And I get an understanding of this environment because, you know, it's, it's gotta go well when I bring them in. I, I, I, you know, I, I'm, I'm dragging them with me. So I see that a lot as, as well. Um, but you know, I personally was in therapy for. I dunno, three or four years. Um, and I really want people to understand that you might come in for a crisis. I know I'm biased, but I'm gonna encourage everyone to go, even when that crisis calms, you still have decades of life before that crisis and patterns and deep-seated things and, uh, you know, that stuff. Um, I'm not saying it takes years to dismantle. I'm saying that just this journey of life is something that, you know, on a, on a week to week basis throws you additional lemons that you've gotta navigate. And some of these voices in our head have been that way for 30 years, 40

Leah:

Right.

Briana:

Yeah. That's a lot to, yeah.

Willow:

and old patterns of protection run so

Leah:

they've been going on for so long that it's gonna take a minute to re-pattern, you know, how you wanna respond to it.

Willow:

I'm curious if, um, if you do, if you do any kind of somatic, uh, release, like getting into the, the physicality of the body or if, um, a lot of the therapy that you're using is, um, you know, more geared toward like, let's yeah cognitive and also like conversational and giving them tools and how to, how to have conversation and communication and all that.

Briana:

I don't do somatic work. If someone is really interested in that, I will refer them out. Um, mine is based on neuroscience, so the brain, so helping understand people or helping people understand why we do what we do from a biological standpoint. And also, uh, EFT, which is called emotionally focused therapy, and CBT, which, you know, everyone's familiar with, typical a lot of people are, which is cognitive behavioral therapy. Those are both sort of, of a cognitive type of nature, sort of intellectual kind of thing happening there. EFT, emotionally focused therapy, um, is my favorite though, above all. And that is because I myself struggle with that the most on a, on a personal level. So for me and my journey, EFT is what took me to the next level of like self-actualization and quality of life and, and, and all of

Willow:

What does it stand for again? EFT

Briana:

emotionally focused therapy.

Willow:

Emotionally focused. Okay. So tell us a little bit about like that process and how that

Briana:

Yeah. Yeah. And, and I think it really is phenomenal and really, really, really, uh, checks a lot of boxes for people that are in corporate America or neurotic, high achievers, ambitious people, things like that. Because getting into

Willow:

Type a kind of more rigid kind of people who have a hard time feeling their emotional body. I have the hardest time coaching those people'cause I'm like, can you just feel, they're like, nah, don't feel anything. I'm like, come on, it's in there. And they just have no sensation. So. Okay. I am so excited about EFT. I only know EFT as emotional freedom technique, like the tapping stuff, but this is totally different.

Briana:

Yes. And I, I know what you're talking about. Right. And, and some people to have it as, um, um, family origin therapy as well. So all the acronyms are, there's a lot

Leah:

Yeah. Yeah.

Willow:

all they're all in bed together, those

Briana:

Yeah. Yeah. Um, but EFT, emotionally focused therapy, right? Is, is, it's, uh, great for couples. It's primarily tailored to couples, but it applies to individuals as well. Right? But if we've got somebody who quite genuinely, you know, they're not lying as, you know, they're not bluffing, I don't feel it. What do you mean? Do I feel it in my body? I, I don't, I'm just feel like I'm sitting here and we're talking and that's all I can give you. Or you'll have a client that says, I don't know, not even about their body, but just about making sense of something. I don't, I don't know. I see clients desperately wanting to answer me, but they, they can't. So I will ask them certain things sometimes as a litmus test to kind of figure out where are we at with this? And EFT really applies to those that are a little bit lost in feeling connected to themselves. for example, when I said, what result are you hoping to find? They'll eventually say like, clarity about something. And then I would latch onto that clarity about why. Why is that clarity significant? And then they probably would eventually say, if I lose my health, I lose everything.

Willow:

Mm

Leah:

Yeah.

Briana:

what's it like to feel like that's even possible that's on

Leah:

Yeah, so her resp, a lot of her responses were like, well, strong resistance to wanting to go to the feeling part. It was like, you know, I, and, and one point when I, you know, brought it to the feeling, it was a lot of it was centered around a. A real resistance, wanna go to that angle instead wanting to stay solution based and not feeling based. She's like, look, I'm, I'm super like up here. I'm in my head. Like, it's not really down here. Um, so, you know, where we, the conclusion we really got to was, you know, what is something that you can do today If it's not an either or, if it's not about not going down the rabbit hole, maybe the rabbit hole can be a reward, but what are two things that you could do today that would satisfy the urge of no, of doing something that you know would be better, even if it's hard to like commit to, you know, you know, and so she was able to go, I'm gonna put a post-it note here, and then I'm gonna, I'm going to get these two things done and at the end, um, I am gonna, you know, do something with my husband. So like she was able to identify and get herself out of the state of, okay, I'm just looping into avoidance. But she never really wanted to drop into the emotion. And I thought that that was really interesting. And she is this very high functioning

Briana:

Yes.

Leah:

really has like not in the mood to do emotions that day.

Willow:

Mm. Mm-hmm.

Briana:

This person is my exact client. I actually work with people that quite literally feel stuck or feel like they're suffering from procrastination or the piles of clothes are mountains, but they're accomplishing a ton at work and all of that. So this, like what you're describing is my exact client. I don't do anything solution-based. So no post-its no specific this, no like holding you accountable to this diet, like, you know, figuratively, none of that. Right. So for my client, I'm thinking of one, she's an older black female, which is important because she had the exact same issue you were describing. She said, you know, or I said, I guess, you know, she describes like how she's living today and she wasn't living that way before.

Leah:

this is a good example, the difference between coaching and therapy.

Willow:

Mm-hmm.

Briana:

yeah.

Leah:

which I think is a good thing to identify for you with one of your questions being around, um, uh, sexology and therapy. So it, it was a good thing to highlight. Uh, I'll kind of

Briana:

Yeah. Yeah, you're exactly right. Coaching is different and I forget that. I, I forget that. Um, yeah, I do have to tell people about that sometimes because they'll want to know. What is the answer? And that is coaching versus this woman that I was thinking of that sounds exactly like your client. She is thriving now. We're probably eight months in and I'm so proud of her. She's accomplishing her to-do list, so she's getting the same result as far as like the post-its and like she's getting her life back. She's, she has lost some weight. She did get a promotion at work, like we're seeing the needle move in all these very tangible categories. But how we got there because she would go home and do her own post-its or whatever she was doing, I don't even know that she already knew how to do.'cause she had lived that life before. She had lived that life 10 years ago while we identified, right is she lost herself and in this aging process and a menopause and all these things, she decided, you know, I'm not really worth it anymore.

Willow:

Mm-hmm.

Briana:

worth it. Like, who's watching me?

Leah:

the meaning underneath it

Briana:

watching me. No one knows. No one knows if I wash my hair and floss today or if I just brush my teeth once, like no one knows, no one's watching me. So it was through that and some, some items with her cultural identity, um, that she'd experienced. And that was actually how we sort of pulled out from this rut. And then she can go on on her own and kind of, she knows what, what to employ to like, make this stuff happen. And then even just coming back to me, right? Somebody who is watching now is really beautiful, right? I care and I wanna hear about this report back to me. And so that's, you know, kind of how we did that. So yes, that makes sense. What an interesting moment, right?

Leah:

I love that through osmosis these are two people that can reach the same place, but using a different modality.

Briana:

Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Leah:

Alright. Well love, love, love. So good to meet you Brianna. Um, thank you and enjoy the rest of the interview and I really wish I could blow it off and keep hanging out.

Willow:

We'll see you soon.

Leah:

Okay. Ciao.

Briana:

Bye.

Willow:

Bye love. All right, so give us, um, just to kind of wrap up this emotional focus therapy or technique. Um, what, what is sort of like, what's the kind of rundown, like what are you looking for when you are, you know, supporting someone using this particular therapy?

Briana:

I'm looking to help someone cut through the noise of their head and it probably being at volume 11 and exhausting. And they might be bullying themselves and have like this negative self talk. And I wanna cut through all of that and strip things all the way back to the tiniest layer that we can possibly slice it to, which is, you know, for example, I'm stressed about X, Y, Z. And if we were to strip that back, like 10 steps, it's, if I don't do this, he'll leave me.

Willow:

Ah, yeah, yeah,

Briana:

I won't provide value anymore. I won't be enough, and that's what I wanna work on. So I want to eat into that. And when you have high achievers or corporate people, or you know, the neurotic people, they want to go to this very intellectual space, this very cognitive space. And that's totally fair. I personally identify with that. So I think EFT helps without saying how do you feel, but getting down to what all these fears in your pattern, sort of what they mean if you were to let them go. And it's usually some sort of like, I'm gonna be a loser. I'm gonna be a loser.

Willow:

right. Which that is like the worst thing that these high achieving people wanna be. Right. This sounds like a great therapy for anyone who's like in that, you know, in that corporate kind of mentality and a world, and in the more just like, what's the, what's the solution and what's the goal? Like, where, where am I heading without, um, just to get them to, you know, to take off all the layers of pressure so that they can actually identify, oh, I am afraid that underneath it all, you know, I won't, I'll, I'll lose my partner, or I'll lose my work job, or whatever it is.

Briana:

Yeah. And to hear someone say, you know, I'll lose my partner, you know, you can go so far with that. Wow. So in all of this, we're afraid we'll lose our partner. What happens if you lose your partner

Willow:

right.

Briana:

and be alone and be alone? What happens if you're alone? What's the point at that point? Right. So when we get everything back to these like very, very foundational layers, they can be quite jarring. And I think in that space. The feelings can come, and that's a great strategy for our intellectuals, our super cognitive people that are very dissociated from our body and our, our feelings and things like that. And say, I don't know, and I don't feel anything, and I don't know what you're talking about. That's a good way to get to it because when they're behaving in all of these ways and these high achievers, there's something motivating that that's passed. Like to get a promotion. Okay. Well, what would it mean to get the promotion? Oh, it'd be, I made more money. What would it mean to make more money? Well, I'd, I'd, I'd be able to take that trip. Oh, what would it mean to take that trip? And you know, at first they're like, you know, maybe even thinking like, how dumb do you think I am asking me these questions? You're asking me the same question 10 times, but I guarantee you what you know, by the end of that, they're like, damn,

Willow:

Yeah.

Briana:

that is what

Willow:

What? And I like that it's oriented toward what, like what does it mean to, you know, what is the catalyst underneath it all? You know, what, what's really driving you? Where's your aeros live? Like, where's your desire? What is it that is really like, really fueling you to, um, behave and act in the, and do the things that you're doing

Briana:

Yeah. And so empowering. Yeah. And so empowering to identify that. Right? So what would it mean to get the promotion, oh, make more money. What would it mean to make more money? I'd be able to go on more trips. What would it mean to go on a tour, whatever, whatever. And maybe we drill that all the way down into someone will wanna date me, I'll be likable enough, right? Or you know, whatever, you know? Oh. So we're in a place where we feel like we have to earn likability. Now we're like cracking some codes and then in them identifying that now we can, we can really build upon that.

Willow:

Oh, what I'm really noticing, what's really cool to me,'cause I use a lot of somatic emotional release work, you know, in my work. So I'm always like, where do you feel it, what does it feel like? What does it look like? What does it sound like? What's it telling you? Dah dah, dah, you know, that. So it's very similar in that it's like, we're digging, we're digging, we're going deeper. What's underneath that? What's, what's underneath that? But I guess I'm always approaching it more from like, where is it in your body, you know, from a more somatic standpoint. But, but I love this emotionally emotional focused technique.'cause I think that's, um, so valuable for, for people who are not oriented toward their emotions, you know, they're more oriented toward their, their thoughts.

Briana:

It is very valuable and it's almost like, I wonder if you and your approach or modality would be the, like next,

Willow:

Next

Briana:

they've graduated?

Willow:

they've done that. Yeah, that's kind of what I was thinking. Yeah.

Briana:

you know,

Willow:

like, I'm gonna send my people to you first who I can't get through to, and then you send yours to

Briana:

Yeah, that's exactly right. Mm-hmm.

Willow:

I love it. That's great. Well, I love that you made the shift and I'm, I'm curious maybe in closing, you know, how, um, how has like your, your high achievement in the executive and the corporate world, like how did all of that, how has that augmented and supported your journey in doing this work and, and being, you know, the high level therapist that you are because of, you know, everything that you had already curated inside of yourself.

Briana:

I think it's, um, afforded me this in, in incredible ability to see through exteriors, right? And see through resumes. So understanding that very accomplished people are still suffering. Maybe even they're, they're kind of like a little bit of a forgotten class'cause they're functioning just fine. Like the house isn't necessarily on fire. There's not some incredible trauma that's happening. So it's afforded me that I also think. It's made me a little bit results driven, so that's kind of nice, right? I'm like, Hey, let's, let's tackle this thing. Like let's be motivated together and let's like keep some momentum. And that's all that corporate background showing up being like results, results. R-O-I-R-O-I, you know, but I think that compliments stuff really nicely. Right? And, you know, being able to talk with somebody who is over intellectualizing things and is trying desperately to make sense of things, but feel like they can't. However, those same approaches serve them beautifully in all their other categories of life, right? In the boardroom or at the office, or even at the gym or, or something. Let me web MD this and like figure it out. But none of that is working. None of that's, none of that's working. Because of my corporate background is how I'm able to identify that client that resonates with me. And I can like explain what they're, what they're doing and they love data. And the neuroscience angle is also really advantageous because That's helpful. So helpful.

Willow:

Oh, that's so cool. I love it. I love that there's different flavors for everyone out there in the world. You know, it's just, it's so, it's so good to know you are there and doing the work that you're doing and, you know, and that I can send people your way who, um, who are not quite ready for, you know, my medicine. So I think it's just, it's so great and I'm just, I am grateful that, uh, you know, that we got to, that. We got to just get to know you more today and, and know this, this work that you're up to. And, um, yeah. Is there any, um, where can people find you? What's your website, social media, places to tune into you?

Briana:

Yep. Website is just my name, Brianna bass.org. Super simple. B-R-I-A-N-A bass.org. And then the socials are Brianna Bass therapy. Also easy.

Willow:

Okay, cool. Great. All right, love. Well, fantastic to sit with you today. And, um, yeah, any, any wise words of wisdom in closing,

Briana:

I go to therapy.

Willow:

go to therapy. I love it.

Briana:

if you're not in crisis,

Willow:

Even if you're not good, go for no reason. I

Briana:

I bet you we can find a reason.

Willow:

Oh, I'm sure. I'm sure there's, there's always something.

Briana:

Yeah.

Willow:

I love it. All right, y'all, well have a, um, a blessed day and we'll see you on the next show.

Announcer:

Now our favorite part, the dish.

Willow:

I found so much of value in the, what we were talking about at the end with the emotional. Focus, emotional focus technique. Um, because you know, there's, like I was saying in the interview, there's so many people that I have a hard time helping'cause they just can't get outta their heads and they can't get in their bodies,

Leah:

Sometimes they refuse to get out of their heads, you know, and they actually don't wanna go into their body

Willow:

Totally.

Leah:

up.

Willow:

Somehow I can always get people into their bodies no matter who they are. But, um, boy, some of them I just wanna send'em to her in the future. We were giggling at the end. We're like, uh,'cause after you left we're like, uh. Yeah, well maybe I might be sending some of my people to you. You send, she's like, yeah, after they work with me, they should work with you. I'm like, yeah, before they work with me, they should work with you. But uh, and then the other thing that I really dug, I really loved, which I am sure I've heard this before, but I I hadn't remembered it so clearly with was those seven, you know, from psychology, the seven different styles? No, it's seven. No, it's seven

Leah:

Oh, okay. You counted it up. Okay.

Willow:

I, yeah. And so, um, you know, different kinds of intimacy. So in honor of my manifestation process of my future life partner, which y'all know, I'm doing religiously all the time. Um, this morning I wrote them all out. I was like, oh, I just love the way we're so emotionally connected and so intellectually connected and sexually amazingly, you know, and just all the things and the dreaming together, the experiential, this spiritual and the, the creativity stuff. You know, how fun, how fun to use those seven things inside of your already existing partnership and really like, pay attention to one each week or one every other day. You know, like give one of those. Seven intimacy building practices like, uh, an actual period time period, you know, where you're like focused in on that one and just see what happens to all the others. Or if you're still, um, calling it in, you know, use it for manifestation. Cool.

Leah:

Yeah. You know, one of the things, if I could just give unsolicited advice, you know, to you and others out there is. A manifests someone you fight well with,

Willow:

Yeah.

Leah:

you know, like who takes a look at disagreements and obstacles and triggers and wants to make the most out of them.

Willow:

Yeah.

Leah:

You know, I've been really grateful for Matt, uh, for our last couple of rubs, um, because he would like, you know, would kind of end in a disagreement, like not feeling very satisfied, right? Like, like, did he get me, uh, does he feel gotten, I don't feel like we really found resolution, but one of the things that I'm just knowing that I can count on him for, and I know he can count on me for this too, it's like he'll come back within 24 hours and say, Hey, I want you to know. I was thinking more about that.

Willow:

Mm.

Leah:

And it's like, it's so, even if it's like, uh uh, something isn't quite finished, like it's, we didn't get the resolution that made us feel like, oh, we're so good now. We get there later. Like he doesn't drop the thread. He doesn't bury it underneath the rug. It's like, maybe we need to take a break'cause we're not finding a piece, but we're gonna chew on it on our own and we'll circle back.

Willow:

That's very evolved. Evolved, enduring pattern.

Leah:

Yeah.

Willow:

I love that.

Leah:

Yeah, but I think what's not enduring, although it might look like enduring, it's they don't stay stuck, which isn't in pattern, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Maybe it's the light side when you're doing enduring pattern.

Willow:

Yeah.'cause it's, you know, still, still ruminating off on your own and taking some time to process and to figure it out. And then coming back with like, here's what I've figured out. You know?

Leah:

you know, one place where we have been really staying stuck and we haven't had a breakthrough around is we need to do our estate planning

Willow:

Oh, okay.

Leah:

and, uh, should one of us die? What goes where? And to who? And I'm surprised that it hasn't been like a walk in the park. But we aren't seeing eye to eye on some things, and it has caused us to keep delaying this,

Willow:

Ah,

Leah:

and I don't really know.

Willow:

Wonder if you guys could do a bubble practice around it?

Leah:

Oh, that's a good idea.

Willow:

Yeah, try that.

Leah:

Do you guys remember, uh, audience members, the bubble? We did it recently on an LXW episode, but it's a cool practice where basically you're, for a, for a difficult conversation or for just a practice, any kind of practice, you create a bubble and you take things out of the bubble that you don't want to interfere, and you put things into the bubble that would support the practice. Good idea, Willow.

Willow:

Yeah, sometimes they come through.

Leah:

Yeah. So yeah, wish us luck on those difficult conversations. You know, the other thing I wanted to say on the episode, but didn't get a chance to say, is to talk about getting therapy before you need therapy.

Willow:

Yeah. She said that at the very end. Yes, she did. She said it very loudly and clearly. It was great. She said, you know, I said, any final words of wisdom? She said, go get therapy even if you don't think you need it. I was like, oh, okay. I don't have time for therapy. I don't think I need it, but if I had time, I might do it. It might be relaxing.

Leah:

Matt and I started therapy again, but we only had one session. We haven't gone back. We haven't rebooked I think we just started to feel really good again.

Willow:

Mm-hmm. That's great.

Leah:

Um, yeah, but I could use, we could use, I want, I really like super solid, really good therapists that, that, that I don't outsmart,

Willow:

Yes.

Leah:

uh, so that they can call me on my shit. Um,'cause I really know how to work'em. Which is like, so not to my advantage,

Willow:

I know, I know.

Leah:

as I was getting ready for this last like, therapist, just going, Leah, do not do that thing. You

Willow:

Uhhuh, Uhhuh, Uhhuh

Leah:

been listening to, like, I've been binge listening to, um, Esther Perel. Yeah. I'm getting so much out of it.

Willow:

She's a badass.

Leah:

she's amazing. I'm seeing so many of these like unconscious parts of myself. Like she had this whole one on anger. And I got so much insight as to like how I get to like that prickle place and like how sensitive I am to criticism and like where that all comes from.

Willow:

my gosh. Send me that one.

Leah:

Okay. Yeah. I'll, well anyways, suddenly episode's all about me, but we can wrap it up here and I say, thanks Brianna.

Willow:

Much

Leah:

Yeah.

Announcer:

Thanks for tuning in. This episode was hosted by Tantric Sex Master Coach and positive psychology facilitator, Leah Piper, as well as by Chinese and Functional Medicine doctor and Taoist Taxology teacher, Dr. Willow Brown. Don't forget your comments, like subscribes and suggestions matter. Let's realize this new world together.

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Dr. Willow Brown

Host
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Leah Piper

Host
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Briana Bass

Guest